Steiner Waldorf Schools Part 3. The problem of racism
My Comments:
PeteK // Dec 18, 2010 at 23:27
I have had ongoing issues with Highland Hall Waldorf school in Northridge, California. They taught my child that white people are \more evolved\ than blacks and Asians. When I questioned this with teachers at the school, they defended the idea – one claiming it was \out of Africa\ theory. The class was Physiology.
Highland Hall teaches Steiner’s racist ideas as part of their curriculum. I have talked extensively with them about this to no avail. Additionally, Highland Hall is the host for WISC – the Waldorf teacher training institute. Waldorf teacher training materials included required reading of Steiner’s most racist ideas. Why?
Please see my blog regarding racism being taught covertly at Highland Hall Waldorf school.
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2009-01-01T00:00:00-08:00&updated-max=2010-01-01T00:00:00-08:00&max-results=4
Highland Hall teaches Steiner’s racist ideas as part of their curriculum. I have talked extensively with them about this to no avail. Additionally, Highland Hall is the host for WISC – the Waldorf teacher training institute. Waldorf teacher training materials included required reading of Steiner’s most racist ideas. Why?
Please see my blog regarding racism being taught covertly at Highland Hall Waldorf school.
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2009-01-01T00:00:00-08:00&updated-max=2010-01-01T00:00:00-08:00&max-results=4
PeteK // Dec 20, 2010 at 04:02
TheBee,
http://www.openwaldorf.com/readingroom.html
If Waldorf schools aren’t racist, why are Waldorf teacher trainees REQUIRED to read books like “Knowledge of Higher Worlds” which contains the following:
“For peoples and races are but steps leading to pure humanity. A race or a nation stands so much the higher, the more perfectly its members express the pure, ideal human type, the further they have worked their way from the physical and perishable to the supersensible and imperishable. The evolution of man through the incarnations in ever higher national and racial forms is thus a process of liberation. Man must finally appear in harmonious perfection.” (Steiner, Knowledge of Higher Worlds p. 207)
And of course the foundation of Waldorf teacher training – Faculty Meetings with Rudolf Steiner (now known as “Discussions with Teachers”):
“The use of the French language quite certainly corrupts the soul. The soul acquires nothing more than the possibility of clichés. Those who enthusiastically speak French transfer that to other languages. The French are also ruining what maintains their dead language, namely, their blood. The French are committing the terrible brutality of moving black people to Europe, but it works, in an even worse way, back on France. It has an enormous effect on the blood and the race and contributes considerably toward French decadence. The French as a race are reverting.” (FACULTY MEETINGS WITH RUDOLF STEINER, pp. 558-559.)
But maybe you were a good Waldorf child, Mr. Bee… From the same book:
Critical thinking is especially hazardous. Good children “have a respect that
forbids them, even in the deepest recess of their heart, to harbour any thoughts
of criticism or opposition.” [KNOWLEDGE OF THE HIGHER WORLDS AND ITS ATTAINMENT,
p. 10.]
This is what Waldorf teachers are TAUGHT in Waldorf teacher training. What else are Waldorf teachers asked to read, Mr. Bee?
How about this… again from Faculty Meetings:
“For the seventh, eighth, and ninth grade independent religious instruction we could move into a freer form and give a theoretical explanation about such things as life before birth and after death. We could give them examples. We could show them how to look at the major cultural connections and about the mission of the human being on Earth. You need only look at Goethe and Jean Paul [i.e., Johann Paul Friedrich Richter, a German author] to see it. You can show everywhere that their capacities come from a life before birth.” (FACULTY MEETINGS WITH RUDOLF STEINER, p. 184.)
So Waldorf teachers are told to teach reincarnation… Agreed?
And of course, they should learn their science, right?
“With the students, we should at least try to…make it clear that, for instance, an island like Great Britain swims in the sea and is held fast by the forces of the stars. In actuality, such islands do not sit directly upon a foundation; they swim and are held fast from outside.” (FACULTY MEETINGS WITH RUDOLF STEINER, p. 607.)
“It is not that the planets move around the Sun, but these three, Mercury, Venus, and the Earth, follow the Sun, and these three, Mars, Jupiter, and Saturn, precede it.” (FACULTY MEETINGS WITH RUDOLF STEINER., pp. 30-31.)
And my person favorite, demonic possession:
Dr. Steiner: “That little girl L.. in the first grade must have something very wrong inside. There is not much we can do. Such cases are increasing in which children are born with a human form, but are not really human beings in relation to their highest I [the highest element of one’s spiritual being]; instead, they are filled with beings that do not belong to the human class. Quite a number of people have been born since the [1890s] without an I, that is, they are not reincarnated, but are human forms filled with a sort of natural demon. There are quite a large number of older people going around who are actually not human beings, but only natural; they are human beings only in regard to their form. We cannot, however, create a school for demons.”
A teacher: “How is that possible?”
Dr. Steiner: “Cosmic error is certainly not impossible. The relationships of individuals coming into earthly existence have long been determined. There are also generations in which individuals have no desire to come into earthly existence and be connected with physicality, or immediately leave at the very beginning. In such cases, other beings that are not quite suited step in…. They are also quite different from human beings in regard to everything spiritual. They can, for example, never remember such things as sentences; they have a memory only for words, not for sentences….
“I do not like to talk about such things since we have often been attacked even without them. Imagine what people would say if they heard that we say there are people who are not human beings. Nevertheless, these are facts. Our culture would not be in such a decline if people felt more strongly that a number of people are going around who, because they are completely ruthless, have become something that is not human, but instead are demons in human form.
“Nevertheless, we do not want to shout that to the world. Our opposition is already large enough. Such things are really shocking to people. I caused enough shock when I needed to say that a very famous university professor, after a very short time between death and rebirth, was reincarnated as a black scientist. We do not want to shout such things out into the world.” (Rudolf Steiner, FACULTY MEETINGS WITH RUDOLF STEINER, Anthroposophical Press, 1998, pp. 649-650.)
But getting back to Steiner’s racist views… rather than your “new” ideas about what Steiner believed, how about if we get it right from Steiner:
“Thus we see that through these abnormal Spirits of Form there are five potential centres of influence where these reflected planetary forces are concentrated and produce in reflect what we know as the five main races of the Earth. Let us now look more closely into the centre which, in Lecture Four, we situated in the interior of Africa. If we state that the Negro race was born of the cooperation between the normal Spirits of Form and the abnormal Spirits of Form centred in Mercury, then from an occult standpoint we are perfectly correct in describing the Negro race as the “Mercury race”. Let us now continue along the line joining the centres or focal points from which the individual races spread outward. We then come to Asia which is the seat of the “Venus race” or the Malayan race. We then move northward across the wide expanse of Asia and we find the Mongolian race which is formed by the Mars forces. Then we cross over into Europe and find the Europeans who in their original racial character are “Jupiter men”. If we cross the ocean to America which is the centre where civilizations or races die, we find there dark “Saturn’s race”, the original Red Indian race. The American Indian race is the “Saturn race”. Thus if you look into the matter more closely from an occult standpoint you will become aware of the five centres where the planetary forces are concentrated and are manifested in the external world. With a progressively more definite and concrete conception of this racial distribution you will develop an inner understanding of the racial characteristics peculiar to the peoples spread over the Earth, an understanding of this unique cooperation of the normal and abnormal Spirits of Form.
“It is valid for the epoch when, at a definite moment of time in the old Atlantean evolution, the peoples began to migrate from a centre in Atlantis and sought the particular centre where they could receive the training appropriate to their race.
“Now how do we look upon a member of the Ethiopian race, of the Mercury race? We see him as one who was originally chosen, who was predestined by the Elohim to express the quintessence of the all-human. But from the Mercury Centre the potent influences of the abnormal Spirits of Form intervened and modified the form of man to such an extent that the Ethiopian race arose. And such was the case with each individual race.
“Now how do these Race Spirits work in and upon man? They work in a very unique way; they permeate his vital energies, they penetrate even down into his physical body. Now you know that the four fundamental members of man find their impress and are reflected in corresponding parts of the physical body: the ‘I’ finds its impress in the blood, the astral body in the nervous system, the etheric or life body in the glandular system. Only the physical body is self-sufficient; it is a reflection of its own inner being which for the man of the present is subject to its own fixed laws. Now those spiritual Beings who are stirring in man and determine his racial character cannot at first work directly into his higher vehicles. They are active first of all in these reflections of the higher vehicles in the physical body. They cannot as yet enter directly into the physical body, but they are active in the three other members, in the blood which is the reflection of the ‘I’; in the nervous system, the reflection of the astral body; and in the glandular system which is the reflection of the etheric body. The Race Spirits, the abnormal Spirits of Form, are active in these three systems, which are part of man’s organic system, but are reflections of the higher vehicles. Thus the physical body of man is determined from within. These various spiritual Beings invade those members of the physical body which are the preliminary drafts, the suggestions of the higher vehicles. Now where, for instance, does Mercury make his influence felt? Under Mercury, I include all the abnormal Spirits of Form to be found in Mercury. He makes his influence felt by cooperating with others, especially in the glandular system. He is active in the glandular (or lymphatic) system where are manifested the forces born of that preponderance of the Mercury forces which are present in the Ethiopian race. Everything which gives the Ethiopian race its distinctive character sterns from the ferment of the Mercury forces in the glandular system of this people. What transforms the undifferentiated universal human form into the distinctive Ethiopian typewith his black pigmentation and woolly or frizzy hair is the consequence of their activity.
“The Semitic people are an example of a modification of collective humanity. Jahve or Jehovah shuts Himself off from the other Elohim and invests this people with a special character by cooperating with the Mars Spirits, in order to bring about a special modification of his people. You will now understand the peculiar character of the Semitic people and its mission. In a profound occult sense the Biblical writer was able to claim that Jahve or Jehovah had made this people his own. If you add to this the fact that Jahve cooperated with the Mars Spirits who worked principally in the blood, you will understand why racial continuity through the blood-stream was of particular importance to the Semitic Hebrew people and why Jahve describes Himself as the God who is present in the blood of the generations, in the blood of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. When he declared himself to be the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, He proclaimed that He was present in the blood-stream of the Patriarchs. Whatsoever works in the blood, whatsoever must be determined through the blood – the cooperation with the Mars Spirits – that is one of the mysteries which give us a deep insight into the wise guidance of all mankind. The blood of mankind is thus subject to a twofold influence; two races emerge, the Mongolian race and the Semitic race. This points to the existence of an important polarity in mankind and we must emphasize the immense importance of this polarity if we wish to plumb the depths of the Folk Souls.
“Consequently the various peoples may assume the most diverse forms. According as the eye or the ear or one of the other senses predominates, so will the different peoples respond in this or that way to the particularnational tendency within the racial character. In consequence of this they are faced with quite specific tasks. The particular task of the Caucasian race is to find the way to the spirit through the senses, for this race is orientated chiefly towards the sense-world. Here is disclosed something that introduces us to the deeper secrets of occultism; it shows how, in those peoples who are subject to the Venus forces, the initial steps in development, even in occult development, must be concentrated on the respiratory system. Amongst the peoples living more in the Western Hemisphere, on the other hand, the initial steps must start from an enrichment and a spiritualization of the life of the senses. This is experienced by those peoples inhabiting countries more towards the West in their stages of higher cognition, in Imagination, Inspiration and Intuition, in so far as the Jupiter Spirit originally modified the character.
“Finally, the abnormal Spirits of Form who have their centre in Saturn work indirectly via all the other systems into the glandular system. In the Saturn race, therefore, in everything to which we must ascribe the Saturn character, we must expect to find the combination of the forces leading to the twilight of mankind, forces which set the seal upon its development and sow the seeds of its ultimate decline. This action and its effect upon the glandular system can be seen in the American Indian race and was the cause of its ultimate extinction. The Saturn influence finally works via all the other systems into the glandular system which secretes the hardest parts of man. This slow decline is characterized by a kind of ossification which is clearly reflected in the external form. If you look at the pictures of the old American Indians the process of ossification described above is evident in the decline of this race. In a race such as this everything pertaining to the forces of theSaturn evolution has become realized in a special manner; then Saturn withdrew into itself, abandoned man to his bony system and thus hastened his decline.” (Rudolf Steiner, The Mission of Single Folk Souls in Relation to Germanic-Nordic Mythology -Lecture 6 -The five main races of Mankind)
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/
PeteK // Dec 20, 2010 at 16:13
Mr Bee wrote:
“The main physical reality behind the concept “Atlantean time” (in my view) needs to be understood as what took place during Cenozoic time – Tertiary and Quaternary – up to the end of the Pleistocene, ending some 8,000 years B.C.”
Yes indeed, that is YOUR VIEW… it wasn’t Steiner’s (I’ve read both Knowledge of Higher Words AND Esoteric Science – as well as dozens of other Steiner books). He was a “scientist” after all… according to Waldorf. Scientists knew words like Cenozoic and Tertiary and Quaternary and Pleistocene back in Steiner’s time. If he meant those periods of time, he would have mentioned them somewhere. He didn’t because he didn’t. You invented this Mr. Bee… as an explanation for Steiner’s weirdness… without ANY support whatsoever in Steiner’s works. Steiner the “scientist” could have expressed man’s development through these periods of time (if he believed it) – very precisely. He wasn’t exactly at a loss for word – was he?
Mr. Bee continues: “While this of course stands out as provocative to say the least to the down the earth consciousness we develop in normal busy day-to-day life, I think it is possible to understand what it refers to.”
Yes – it is a lesson about Steiner’s racist views. Anyone can see that – very plainly. Why do teachers need to know this – if not to relate and apply what Steiner believed about the races to THEIR STUDENTS?
Waldorf teachers are taught Steiner’s racism for racist reasons – to separate and judge children by their race (among other things like head size and temperament). That’s IT! No connection to the scientific view of the early development of humans – this is the invention of Mr. Bee alone – without support from anything in Steiner’s works!
PK
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2009-01-01T00%3A00%3A00-08%3A00&updated-max=2010-01-01T00%3A00%3A00-08%3A00&max-results=4
http://www.openwaldorf.com/readingroom.html
If Waldorf schools aren’t racist, why are Waldorf teacher trainees REQUIRED to read books like “Knowledge of Higher Worlds” which contains the following:
“For peoples and races are but steps leading to pure humanity. A race or a nation stands so much the higher, the more perfectly its members express the pure, ideal human type, the further they have worked their way from the physical and perishable to the supersensible and imperishable. The evolution of man through the incarnations in ever higher national and racial forms is thus a process of liberation. Man must finally appear in harmonious perfection.” (Steiner, Knowledge of Higher Worlds p. 207)
And of course the foundation of Waldorf teacher training – Faculty Meetings with Rudolf Steiner (now known as “Discussions with Teachers”):
“The use of the French language quite certainly corrupts the soul. The soul acquires nothing more than the possibility of clichés. Those who enthusiastically speak French transfer that to other languages. The French are also ruining what maintains their dead language, namely, their blood. The French are committing the terrible brutality of moving black people to Europe, but it works, in an even worse way, back on France. It has an enormous effect on the blood and the race and contributes considerably toward French decadence. The French as a race are reverting.” (FACULTY MEETINGS WITH RUDOLF STEINER, pp. 558-559.)
But maybe you were a good Waldorf child, Mr. Bee… From the same book:
Critical thinking is especially hazardous. Good children “have a respect that
forbids them, even in the deepest recess of their heart, to harbour any thoughts
of criticism or opposition.” [KNOWLEDGE OF THE HIGHER WORLDS AND ITS ATTAINMENT,
p. 10.]
This is what Waldorf teachers are TAUGHT in Waldorf teacher training. What else are Waldorf teachers asked to read, Mr. Bee?
How about this… again from Faculty Meetings:
“For the seventh, eighth, and ninth grade independent religious instruction we could move into a freer form and give a theoretical explanation about such things as life before birth and after death. We could give them examples. We could show them how to look at the major cultural connections and about the mission of the human being on Earth. You need only look at Goethe and Jean Paul [i.e., Johann Paul Friedrich Richter, a German author] to see it. You can show everywhere that their capacities come from a life before birth.” (FACULTY MEETINGS WITH RUDOLF STEINER, p. 184.)
So Waldorf teachers are told to teach reincarnation… Agreed?
And of course, they should learn their science, right?
“With the students, we should at least try to…make it clear that, for instance, an island like Great Britain swims in the sea and is held fast by the forces of the stars. In actuality, such islands do not sit directly upon a foundation; they swim and are held fast from outside.” (FACULTY MEETINGS WITH RUDOLF STEINER, p. 607.)
“It is not that the planets move around the Sun, but these three, Mercury, Venus, and the Earth, follow the Sun, and these three, Mars, Jupiter, and Saturn, precede it.” (FACULTY MEETINGS WITH RUDOLF STEINER., pp. 30-31.)
And my person favorite, demonic possession:
Dr. Steiner: “That little girl L.. in the first grade must have something very wrong inside. There is not much we can do. Such cases are increasing in which children are born with a human form, but are not really human beings in relation to their highest I [the highest element of one’s spiritual being]; instead, they are filled with beings that do not belong to the human class. Quite a number of people have been born since the [1890s] without an I, that is, they are not reincarnated, but are human forms filled with a sort of natural demon. There are quite a large number of older people going around who are actually not human beings, but only natural; they are human beings only in regard to their form. We cannot, however, create a school for demons.”
A teacher: “How is that possible?”
Dr. Steiner: “Cosmic error is certainly not impossible. The relationships of individuals coming into earthly existence have long been determined. There are also generations in which individuals have no desire to come into earthly existence and be connected with physicality, or immediately leave at the very beginning. In such cases, other beings that are not quite suited step in…. They are also quite different from human beings in regard to everything spiritual. They can, for example, never remember such things as sentences; they have a memory only for words, not for sentences….
“I do not like to talk about such things since we have often been attacked even without them. Imagine what people would say if they heard that we say there are people who are not human beings. Nevertheless, these are facts. Our culture would not be in such a decline if people felt more strongly that a number of people are going around who, because they are completely ruthless, have become something that is not human, but instead are demons in human form.
“Nevertheless, we do not want to shout that to the world. Our opposition is already large enough. Such things are really shocking to people. I caused enough shock when I needed to say that a very famous university professor, after a very short time between death and rebirth, was reincarnated as a black scientist. We do not want to shout such things out into the world.” (Rudolf Steiner, FACULTY MEETINGS WITH RUDOLF STEINER, Anthroposophical Press, 1998, pp. 649-650.)
But getting back to Steiner’s racist views… rather than your “new” ideas about what Steiner believed, how about if we get it right from Steiner:
“Thus we see that through these abnormal Spirits of Form there are five potential centres of influence where these reflected planetary forces are concentrated and produce in reflect what we know as the five main races of the Earth. Let us now look more closely into the centre which, in Lecture Four, we situated in the interior of Africa. If we state that the Negro race was born of the cooperation between the normal Spirits of Form and the abnormal Spirits of Form centred in Mercury, then from an occult standpoint we are perfectly correct in describing the Negro race as the “Mercury race”. Let us now continue along the line joining the centres or focal points from which the individual races spread outward. We then come to Asia which is the seat of the “Venus race” or the Malayan race. We then move northward across the wide expanse of Asia and we find the Mongolian race which is formed by the Mars forces. Then we cross over into Europe and find the Europeans who in their original racial character are “Jupiter men”. If we cross the ocean to America which is the centre where civilizations or races die, we find there dark “Saturn’s race”, the original Red Indian race. The American Indian race is the “Saturn race”. Thus if you look into the matter more closely from an occult standpoint you will become aware of the five centres where the planetary forces are concentrated and are manifested in the external world. With a progressively more definite and concrete conception of this racial distribution you will develop an inner understanding of the racial characteristics peculiar to the peoples spread over the Earth, an understanding of this unique cooperation of the normal and abnormal Spirits of Form.
“It is valid for the epoch when, at a definite moment of time in the old Atlantean evolution, the peoples began to migrate from a centre in Atlantis and sought the particular centre where they could receive the training appropriate to their race.
“Now how do we look upon a member of the Ethiopian race, of the Mercury race? We see him as one who was originally chosen, who was predestined by the Elohim to express the quintessence of the all-human. But from the Mercury Centre the potent influences of the abnormal Spirits of Form intervened and modified the form of man to such an extent that the Ethiopian race arose. And such was the case with each individual race.
“Now how do these Race Spirits work in and upon man? They work in a very unique way; they permeate his vital energies, they penetrate even down into his physical body. Now you know that the four fundamental members of man find their impress and are reflected in corresponding parts of the physical body: the ‘I’ finds its impress in the blood, the astral body in the nervous system, the etheric or life body in the glandular system. Only the physical body is self-sufficient; it is a reflection of its own inner being which for the man of the present is subject to its own fixed laws. Now those spiritual Beings who are stirring in man and determine his racial character cannot at first work directly into his higher vehicles. They are active first of all in these reflections of the higher vehicles in the physical body. They cannot as yet enter directly into the physical body, but they are active in the three other members, in the blood which is the reflection of the ‘I’; in the nervous system, the reflection of the astral body; and in the glandular system which is the reflection of the etheric body. The Race Spirits, the abnormal Spirits of Form, are active in these three systems, which are part of man’s organic system, but are reflections of the higher vehicles. Thus the physical body of man is determined from within. These various spiritual Beings invade those members of the physical body which are the preliminary drafts, the suggestions of the higher vehicles. Now where, for instance, does Mercury make his influence felt? Under Mercury, I include all the abnormal Spirits of Form to be found in Mercury. He makes his influence felt by cooperating with others, especially in the glandular system. He is active in the glandular (or lymphatic) system where are manifested the forces born of that preponderance of the Mercury forces which are present in the Ethiopian race. Everything which gives the Ethiopian race its distinctive character sterns from the ferment of the Mercury forces in the glandular system of this people. What transforms the undifferentiated universal human form into the distinctive Ethiopian typewith his black pigmentation and woolly or frizzy hair is the consequence of their activity.
“The Semitic people are an example of a modification of collective humanity. Jahve or Jehovah shuts Himself off from the other Elohim and invests this people with a special character by cooperating with the Mars Spirits, in order to bring about a special modification of his people. You will now understand the peculiar character of the Semitic people and its mission. In a profound occult sense the Biblical writer was able to claim that Jahve or Jehovah had made this people his own. If you add to this the fact that Jahve cooperated with the Mars Spirits who worked principally in the blood, you will understand why racial continuity through the blood-stream was of particular importance to the Semitic Hebrew people and why Jahve describes Himself as the God who is present in the blood of the generations, in the blood of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. When he declared himself to be the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, He proclaimed that He was present in the blood-stream of the Patriarchs. Whatsoever works in the blood, whatsoever must be determined through the blood – the cooperation with the Mars Spirits – that is one of the mysteries which give us a deep insight into the wise guidance of all mankind. The blood of mankind is thus subject to a twofold influence; two races emerge, the Mongolian race and the Semitic race. This points to the existence of an important polarity in mankind and we must emphasize the immense importance of this polarity if we wish to plumb the depths of the Folk Souls.
“Consequently the various peoples may assume the most diverse forms. According as the eye or the ear or one of the other senses predominates, so will the different peoples respond in this or that way to the particularnational tendency within the racial character. In consequence of this they are faced with quite specific tasks. The particular task of the Caucasian race is to find the way to the spirit through the senses, for this race is orientated chiefly towards the sense-world. Here is disclosed something that introduces us to the deeper secrets of occultism; it shows how, in those peoples who are subject to the Venus forces, the initial steps in development, even in occult development, must be concentrated on the respiratory system. Amongst the peoples living more in the Western Hemisphere, on the other hand, the initial steps must start from an enrichment and a spiritualization of the life of the senses. This is experienced by those peoples inhabiting countries more towards the West in their stages of higher cognition, in Imagination, Inspiration and Intuition, in so far as the Jupiter Spirit originally modified the character.
“Finally, the abnormal Spirits of Form who have their centre in Saturn work indirectly via all the other systems into the glandular system. In the Saturn race, therefore, in everything to which we must ascribe the Saturn character, we must expect to find the combination of the forces leading to the twilight of mankind, forces which set the seal upon its development and sow the seeds of its ultimate decline. This action and its effect upon the glandular system can be seen in the American Indian race and was the cause of its ultimate extinction. The Saturn influence finally works via all the other systems into the glandular system which secretes the hardest parts of man. This slow decline is characterized by a kind of ossification which is clearly reflected in the external form. If you look at the pictures of the old American Indians the process of ossification described above is evident in the decline of this race. In a race such as this everything pertaining to the forces of theSaturn evolution has become realized in a special manner; then Saturn withdrew into itself, abandoned man to his bony system and thus hastened his decline.” (Rudolf Steiner, The Mission of Single Folk Souls in Relation to Germanic-Nordic Mythology -Lecture 6 -The five main races of Mankind)
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/
PeteK // Dec 20, 2010 at 16:13
Mr Bee wrote:
“The main physical reality behind the concept “Atlantean time” (in my view) needs to be understood as what took place during Cenozoic time – Tertiary and Quaternary – up to the end of the Pleistocene, ending some 8,000 years B.C.”
Yes indeed, that is YOUR VIEW… it wasn’t Steiner’s (I’ve read both Knowledge of Higher Words AND Esoteric Science – as well as dozens of other Steiner books). He was a “scientist” after all… according to Waldorf. Scientists knew words like Cenozoic and Tertiary and Quaternary and Pleistocene back in Steiner’s time. If he meant those periods of time, he would have mentioned them somewhere. He didn’t because he didn’t. You invented this Mr. Bee… as an explanation for Steiner’s weirdness… without ANY support whatsoever in Steiner’s works. Steiner the “scientist” could have expressed man’s development through these periods of time (if he believed it) – very precisely. He wasn’t exactly at a loss for word – was he?
Mr. Bee continues: “While this of course stands out as provocative to say the least to the down the earth consciousness we develop in normal busy day-to-day life, I think it is possible to understand what it refers to.”
Yes – it is a lesson about Steiner’s racist views. Anyone can see that – very plainly. Why do teachers need to know this – if not to relate and apply what Steiner believed about the races to THEIR STUDENTS?
Waldorf teachers are taught Steiner’s racism for racist reasons – to separate and judge children by their race (among other things like head size and temperament). That’s IT! No connection to the scientific view of the early development of humans – this is the invention of Mr. Bee alone – without support from anything in Steiner’s works!
PK
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2009-01-01T00%3A00%3A00-08%3A00&updated-max=2010-01-01T00%3A00%3A00-08%3A00&max-results=4
- TheBee,
http://www.openwaldorf.com/readingroom.html
If Waldorf schools aren’t racist, why are Waldorf teacher trainees REQUIRED to read books like “Knowledge of Higher Worlds” which contains the following:
“For peoples and races are but steps leading to pure humanity. A race or a nation stands so much the higher, the more perfectly its members express the pure, ideal human type, the further they have worked their way from the physical and perishable to the supersensible and imperishable. The evolution of man through the incarnations in ever higher national and racial forms is thus a process of liberation. Man must finally appear in harmonious perfection.” (Steiner, Knowledge of Higher Worlds p. 207)
And of course the foundation of Waldorf teacher training – Faculty Meetings with Rudolf Steiner (now known as “Discussions with Teachers”):
“The use of the French language quite certainly corrupts the soul. The soul acquires nothing more than the possibility of clichés. Those who enthusiastically speak French transfer that to other languages. The French are also ruining what maintains their dead language, namely, their blood. The French are committing the terrible brutality of moving black people to Europe, but it works, in an even worse way, back on France. It has an enormous effect on the blood and the race and contributes considerably toward French decadence. The French as a race are reverting.” (FACULTY MEETINGS WITH RUDOLF STEINER, pp. 558-559.)
But maybe you were a good Waldorf child, Mr. Bee… From the same book:
Critical thinking is especially hazardous. Good children “have a respect that
forbids them, even in the deepest recess of their heart, to harbour any thoughts
of criticism or opposition.” [KNOWLEDGE OF THE HIGHER WORLDS AND ITS ATTAINMENT,
p. 10.]
This is what Waldorf teachers are TAUGHT in Waldorf teacher training. What else are Waldorf teachers asked to read, Mr. Bee?
How about this… again from Faculty Meetings:
“For the seventh, eighth, and ninth grade independent religious instruction we could move into a freer form and give a theoretical explanation about such things as life before birth and after death. We could give them examples. We could show them how to look at the major cultural connections and about the mission of the human being on Earth. You need only look at Goethe and Jean Paul [i.e., Johann Paul Friedrich Richter, a German author] to see it. You can show everywhere that their capacities come from a life before birth.” (FACULTY MEETINGS WITH RUDOLF STEINER, p. 184.)
So Waldorf teachers are told to teach reincarnation… Agreed?
And of course, they should learn their science, right?
“With the students, we should at least try to…make it clear that, for instance, an island like Great Britain swims in the sea and is held fast by the forces of the stars. In actuality, such islands do not sit directly upon a foundation; they swim and are held fast from outside.” (FACULTY MEETINGS WITH RUDOLF STEINER, p. 607.)
“It is not that the planets move around the Sun, but these three, Mercury, Venus, and the Earth, follow the Sun, and these three, Mars, Jupiter, and Saturn, precede it.” (FACULTY MEETINGS WITH RUDOLF STEINER., pp. 30-31.)
And my person favorite, demonic possession:
Dr. Steiner: “That little girl L.. in the first grade must have something very wrong inside. There is not much we can do. Such cases are increasing in which children are born with a human form, but are not really human beings in relation to their highest I [the highest element of one’s spiritual being]; instead, they are filled with beings that do not belong to the human class. Quite a number of people have been born since the [1890s] without an I, that is, they are not reincarnated, but are human forms filled with a sort of natural demon. There are quite a large number of older people going around who are actually not human beings, but only natural; they are human beings only in regard to their form. We cannot, however, create a school for demons.”
A teacher: “How is that possible?”
Dr. Steiner: “Cosmic error is certainly not impossible. The relationships of individuals coming into earthly existence have long been determined. There are also generations in which individuals have no desire to come into earthly existence and be connected with physicality, or immediately leave at the very beginning. In such cases, other beings that are not quite suited step in…. They are also quite different from human beings in regard to everything spiritual. They can, for example, never remember such things as sentences; they have a memory only for words, not for sentences….
“I do not like to talk about such things since we have often been attacked even without them. Imagine what people would say if they heard that we say there are people who are not human beings. Nevertheless, these are facts. Our culture would not be in such a decline if people felt more strongly that a number of people are going around who, because they are completely ruthless, have become something that is not human, but instead are demons in human form.
“Nevertheless, we do not want to shout that to the world. Our opposition is already large enough. Such things are really shocking to people. I caused enough shock when I needed to say that a very famous university professor, after a very short time between death and rebirth, was reincarnated as a black scientist. We do not want to shout such things out into the world.” (Rudolf Steiner, FACULTY MEETINGS WITH RUDOLF STEINER, Anthroposophical Press, 1998, pp. 649-650.)
But getting back to Steiner’s racist views… rather than your “new” ideas about what Steiner believed, how about if we get it right from Steiner:
“Thus we see that through these abnormal Spirits of Form there are five potential centres of influence where these reflected planetary forces are concentrated and produce in reflect what we know as the five main races of the Earth. Let us now look more closely into the centre which, in Lecture Four, we situated in the interior of Africa. If we state that the Negro race was born of the cooperation between the normal Spirits of Form and the abnormal Spirits of Form centred in Mercury, then from an occult standpoint we are perfectly correct in describing the Negro race as the “Mercury race”. Let us now continue along the line joining the centres or focal points from which the individual races spread outward. We then come to Asia which is the seat of the “Venus race” or the Malayan race. We then move northward across the wide expanse of Asia and we find the Mongolian race which is formed by the Mars forces. Then we cross over into Europe and find the Europeans who in their original racial character are “Jupiter men”. If we cross the ocean to America which is the centre where civilizations or races die, we find there dark “Saturn’s race”, the original Red Indian race. The American Indian race is the “Saturn race”. Thus if you look into the matter more closely from an occult standpoint you will become aware of the five centres where the planetary forces are concentrated and are manifested in the external world. With a progressively more definite and concrete conception of this racial distribution you will develop an inner understanding of the racial characteristics peculiar to the peoples spread over the Earth, an understanding of this unique cooperation of the normal and abnormal Spirits of Form.
“It is valid for the epoch when, at a definite moment of time in the old Atlantean evolution, the peoples began to migrate from a centre in Atlantis and sought the particular centre where they could receive the training appropriate to their race.
“Now how do we look upon a member of the Ethiopian race, of the Mercury race? We see him as one who was originally chosen, who was predestined by the Elohim to express the quintessence of the all-human. But from the Mercury Centre the potent influences of the abnormal Spirits of Form intervened and modified the form of man to such an extent that the Ethiopian race arose. And such was the case with each individual race.
“Now how do these Race Spirits work in and upon man? They work in a very unique way; they permeate his vital energies, they penetrate even down into his physical body. Now you know that the four fundamental members of man find their impress and are reflected in corresponding parts of the physical body: the ‘I’ finds its impress in the blood, the astral body in the nervous system, the etheric or life body in the glandular system. Only the physical body is self-sufficient; it is a reflection of its own inner being which for the man of the present is subject to its own fixed laws. Now those spiritual Beings who are stirring in man and determine his racial character cannot at first work directly into his higher vehicles. They are active first of all in these reflections of the higher vehicles in the physical body. They cannot as yet enter directly into the physical body, but they are active in the three other members, in the blood which is the reflection of the ‘I’; in the nervous system, the reflection of the astral body; and in the glandular system which is the reflection of the etheric body. The Race Spirits, the abnormal Spirits of Form, are active in these three systems, which are part of man’s organic system, but are reflections of the higher vehicles. Thus the physical body of man is determined from within. These various spiritual Beings invade those members of the physical body which are the preliminary drafts, the suggestions of the higher vehicles. Now where, for instance, does Mercury make his influence felt? Under Mercury, I include all the abnormal Spirits of Form to be found in Mercury. He makes his influence felt by cooperating with others, especially in the glandular system. He is active in the glandular (or lymphatic) system where are manifested the forces born of that preponderance of the Mercury forces which are present in the Ethiopian race. Everything which gives the Ethiopian race its distinctive character sterns from the ferment of the Mercury forces in the glandular system of this people. What transforms the undifferentiated universal human form into the distinctive Ethiopian typewith his black pigmentation and woolly or frizzy hair is the consequence of their activity.
“The Semitic people are an example of a modification of collective humanity. Jahve or Jehovah shuts Himself off from the other Elohim and invests this people with a special character by cooperating with the Mars Spirits, in order to bring about a special modification of his people. You will now understand the peculiar character of the Semitic people and its mission. In a profound occult sense the Biblical writer was able to claim that Jahve or Jehovah had made this people his own. If you add to this the fact that Jahve cooperated with the Mars Spirits who worked principally in the blood, you will understand why racial continuity through the blood-stream was of particular importance to the Semitic Hebrew people and why Jahve describes Himself as the God who is present in the blood of the generations, in the blood of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. When he declared himself to be the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, He proclaimed that He was present in the blood-stream of the Patriarchs. Whatsoever works in the blood, whatsoever must be determined through the blood – the cooperation with the Mars Spirits – that is one of the mysteries which give us a deep insight into the wise guidance of all mankind. The blood of mankind is thus subject to a twofold influence; two races emerge, the Mongolian race and the Semitic race. This points to the existence of an important polarity in mankind and we must emphasize the immense importance of this polarity if we wish to plumb the depths of the Folk Souls.
“Consequently the various peoples may assume the most diverse forms. According as the eye or the ear or one of the other senses predominates, so will the different peoples respond in this or that way to the particularnational tendency within the racial character. In consequence of this they are faced with quite specific tasks. The particular task of the Caucasian race is to find the way to the spirit through the senses, for this race is orientated chiefly towards the sense-world. Here is disclosed something that introduces us to the deeper secrets of occultism; it shows how, in those peoples who are subject to the Venus forces, the initial steps in development, even in occult development, must be concentrated on the respiratory system. Amongst the peoples living more in the Western Hemisphere, on the other hand, the initial steps must start from an enrichment and a spiritualization of the life of the senses. This is experienced by those peoples inhabiting countries more towards the West in their stages of higher cognition, in Imagination, Inspiration and Intuition, in so far as the Jupiter Spirit originally modified the character.
“Finally, the abnormal Spirits of Form who have their centre in Saturn work indirectly via all the other systems into the glandular system. In the Saturn race, therefore, in everything to which we must ascribe the Saturn character, we must expect to find the combination of the forces leading to the twilight of mankind, forces which set the seal upon its development and sow the seeds of its ultimate decline. This action and its effect upon the glandular system can be seen in the American Indian race and was the cause of its ultimate extinction. The Saturn influence finally works via all the other systems into the glandular system which secretes the hardest parts of man. This slow decline is characterized by a kind of ossification which is clearly reflected in the external form. If you look at the pictures of the old American Indians the process of ossification described above is evident in the decline of this race. In a race such as this everything pertaining to the forces of theSaturn evolution has become realized in a special manner; then Saturn withdrew into itself, abandoned man to his bony system and thus hastened his decline.” (Rudolf Steiner, The Mission of Single Folk Souls in Relation to Germanic-Nordic Mythology -Lecture 6 -The five main races of Mankind)
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/ - Mr Bee wrote:
“The main physical reality behind the concept “Atlantean time” (in my view) needs to be understood as what took place during Cenozoic time – Tertiary and Quaternary – up to the end of the Pleistocene, ending some 8,000 years B.C.”
Yes indeed, that is YOUR VIEW… it wasn’t Steiner’s (I’ve read both Knowledge of Higher Words AND Esoteric Science – as well as dozens of other Steiner books). He was a “scientist” after all… according to Waldorf. Scientists knew words like Cenozoic and Tertiary and Quaternary and Pleistocene back in Steiner’s time. If he meant those periods of time, he would have mentioned them somewhere. He didn’t because he didn’t. You invented this Mr. Bee… as an explanation for Steiner’s weirdness… without ANY support whatsoever in Steiner’s works. Steiner the “scientist” could have expressed man’s development through these periods of time (if he believed it) – very precisely. He wasn’t exactly at a loss for word – was he?
Mr. Bee continues: “While this of course stands out as provocative to say the least to the down the earth consciousness we develop in normal busy day-to-day life, I think it is possible to understand what it refers to.”
Yes – it is a lesson about Steiner’s racist views. Anyone can see that – very plainly. Why do teachers need to know this – if not to relate and apply what Steiner believed about the races to THEIR STUDENTS?
Waldorf teachers are taught Steiner’s racism for racist reasons – to separate and judge children by their race (among other things like head size and temperament). That’s IT! No connection to the scientific view of the early development of humans – this is the invention of Mr. Bee alone – without support from anything in Steiner’s works!
PK
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2009-01-01T00%3A00%3A00-08%3A00&updated-max=2010-01-01T00%3A00%3A00-08%3A00&max-results=4
- Mr. Bee,
Is there any scientific basis for Steiner’s anti-Semitism?
“Today all aspects of the Jews are dominated by racial qualities. Above all they marry among themselves. They see the racial qualities, not the spiritual. And this is what must be said in reply to the question: has the Jewish people fulfilled its mission within the evolution of human knowledge? It has fulfilled it; for in earlier times one single people was needed to bring about a certain monotheism. But today spiritual insight itself is necessary. Therefore this mission has been fulfilled. And therefore this Jewish mission as such, as a Jewish mission, is no longer necessary in evolution; instead the only proper thing would be for the Jews to blend in with the other peoples and disappear into the other peoples.” (Steiner, Die Geschichte der Menschheit und die Weltanschauungen der Kulturvölker p. 190)
“[Jesus felt]: All the forces of soul which I believed had been bestowed upon me lead only to the realisation that in the evolution of the Jewish people there is no longer the capacity to reach the heights of Divine revelations.” (Steiner, 1913, The Fifth Gospel. (1913) Trans. C. Davy & D.S. Osmond. London: Rudolf Steiner Press, 1968. p. 67)
“…the Jahve forces from the moon sphere meet and cooperate with the Mars spirits and thus a special kind of modification arises, namely, the Semitic race. Here is the occult explanation for the origin of the Semites. The Semitic people are an example of a modification of collective humanity. Jahve or Jehovah shuts himself off from the other Elohim and invests this people with a special character by cooperating with the Mars spirits, in order to bring about a special modification of his people. You will now understand the peculiar character of the Semitic people and its mission.”(Steiner, The Mission of Folk Souls p. 105)
PeteK // Dec 20, 2010 at 17:34
Mr. Bee, while both re-inventing Steiner’s meanings and explaining why we cannot understand what Steiner meant by reading his words, wrote:
“Quaternary time constitutes the second half of “Atlantis”/Atlantean time, characterized by the repeated Ice ages. And when Steiner comments on “lower” and “higher” races at the time, you need to understand something about the human forms, some “higher”, some “lower” that developed during Quaternary time, and with the Neanderthals being one of the “lower” races at the end of the “Atlantean” time”
Steiner, on the other hand, was very explicit about what he meant when he wrote:
“The ancestors of the Atlanteans lived in a region which has disappeared, the main part of which lay south of contemporary Asia. In theosophical writings they are called the Lemurians. After they had passed through various stages of development the greatest part of them declined. These became stunted men, whose descendants still inhabit certain parts of the earth today as so-called savage tribes. Only a small part of Lemurian humanity was capable of further development. From this part the Atlanteans were formed. Later, something similar again took place. The greatest part of the Atlantean population declined, and from a small portion are descended the so-called Aryans who comprise present-day civilized humanity. According to the nomenclature of the science of the spirit, the Lemurians, Atlanteans and Aryans are root races of mankind.” (Steiner, Cosmic Memory pp. 45-46)
No mention of Neanderthals, Mr. Bee. By the way, the word Neanderthal originated in Germany in 1860 where the first one was discovered. If Steiner was talking about Neanderthals, why didn’t he say so? He didn’t because he wasn’t. So who did Steiner consider “savages” and lower human forms? He explains here:
“But all such questions are illuminated as soon as we recognize the nature of the spiritual essence which lies at the back of our blood. Who can deny that this question is closely linked to that of race, which at the present time is once more coming markedly to the front? Yet this question of race is one that we can never understand until we understand the mysteries of the blood and of the results accruing from the mingling of the blood of different races. And finally, there is yet one other question, the importance of which is becoming more and more acute as we endeavor to extricate ourselves from the hitherto aimless methods of dealing with it, and seek to approach it in its more comprehensive bearings. This problem is that of colonisation, which crops up wherever civilised races come into contact with the uncivilised: namely – To what extent are uncivilised peoples capable of becoming civilised? How can a Negro or an utterly barbaric savage become civilised? And in what way ought we to deal with them? And here we have to consider not only the feelings due to a vague morality, but we are also confronted by great, serious, and vital problems of existence itself. Those who are not aware of the conditions governing a people – whether it be on the up- or down-grade of its evolution, and whether the one or the other is a matter conditioned by its blood – such people as these will, indeed, be unlikely to hit on the right mode of introducing civilisation to an alien race. These are all matters which arise as soon as the Blood Question is touched upon.” (Steiner, The Occult Significance of Blood p. 13)
Steiner was a racist – by any definition of the term. Please stop re-inventing Steiner for the public Mr. Bee… it’s obvious he wasn’t who you claim he was.
PK
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/2009/11/pete-k-declares-war-on-racism-at_06.html
PeteK // Dec 20, 2010 at 22:56
Thank you Thetis. Speaking of statistical controls – here’s an interesting statistic (please follow my Ahrimanic math):
It was reported at Highland Hall at a very rare “open” board meeting (I think there has only been one) that Highland Hall lost 25% of their students EACH year. That included the graduating class… so with a student body of approximately 400 students, that’s a turnover of 100 students – minus the graduating class each year (25 or so students) – leaves 75 students EACH YEAR who leave or whose parents pull them out.
Looking at it a different way – for every class of 25 students who graduate each year, (25% of 25 students = 6 students per year x 12 years – 1st grade through 12th) 72 students PER GRADUATING CLASS were removed (had their educations interrupted) at Highland Hall.
Those students, who presumably finish school elsewhere, are never considered when Waldorf talks of “Waldorf students”. Those students are not statistically represented in Waldorf inquiries (other than what I presented here).
Assuming Highland Hall (a seasoned and celebrated 50-year-old Waldorf school) is fairly typical of Waldorf schools everywhere, 3/4 of students who enter Waldorf don’t continue on to finish Waldorf. Highland Hall keeps their money, by the way. In my opinion, full disclosure of what Waldorf is would end this. But since, like all Waldorf schools, Highland Hall isn’t child-centered, it’s a win-win for them to attract ANY family. Getting even one or two years of tuition from unsuspecting families helps fuel their system. They can afford to provide free tuition to Anthroposophical families (like mine). Why disclose what’s behind Waldorf? Isn’t it up to the parents to determine if they are lying?
PK
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/2010_03_01_archive.html
PeteK // Dec 29, 2010 at 15:43
Anthroposophists don’t “get” that Steiner’s Anthroposophy is racist. That much is plain to see. Any time one talks about “higher” and “lower” racial expressions of humans, that’s RACIST. It isn’t noticing the differences between the races that makes Steiner’s racial theory racist, it is the ranking of the races in racial hierarchies that clinches it. THERE IS NO QUESTION – STEINER WAS A RACIST!!!
Steiner taught that a hierarchy of races exists and placed the white race above others. Waldorf teachers are taught to interact with children in accordance with their race. Waldorf teachers HAVE TO BE racist in order to do their job – ie helping the child incarnate in human form. They won’t admit that they are – but it is their job to observe and interact with each child in accordance with the child’s race. Anyone who says otherwise is being dishonest.
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/
PeteK // Jan 1, 2011 at 23:21
Tomdehavas,
Please read message #27. Highland Hall Waldorf School taught Steiner’s racist doctrine to my child. Period. No denial from them (other than they don’t think it was racist). They taught what I claim in message #27. So… clearly the TEACHING of racist ideas exists in Waldorf.
PeteK // Jan 2, 2011 at 00:09
Having been married to a second-generation Anthroposophist, Waldorf graduate and currently Waldorf teacher (whose mother and father were both Waldorf teachers)… I can say, categorically, that at least some Waldorf teachers use a child’s physical and racial traits when evaluating them. In my two-and-a-half decade experience with Waldorf, I can say I’ve met hundreds of Waldorf teachers who do this.
Virtually ALL Waldorf teachers believe in assigning a temperament to each child. It is indeed, part of their training. Temperaments are based on physical, hereditary traits.
“The temperament is the meeting of the spiritual aspect of oneself, which one refers to as ‘I’, and the contributions of the father and mother. The temperament is the result of the blending of these two streams, the spirit and heredity.” (From “Waldorf Education – A Family Guide” – p. 60 The Role of Temperament in Understanding the Child by Rene Querido)
How do the temperaments find their way into everyday activities?
“If you put on a play, you should cast the characters according to the temperaments of your students. You might, for example, ask your cholerics to play Julius Caesar, and you might cast your sanguines as the messengers, since they would enjoy running in and out with the news. The melancholics love philosophical roles. … The phlegmatics, on the other hand, like the parts where they can sit and think, removed from the central action of the play.”
(From “Waldorf Education – A Family Guide” – p. 65-66 The Role of Temperament in Understanding the Child by Rene Querido)
Another way that racism through the temperaments is expressed is through the “Greek Olympics” or “Pentathlon” games in the 5th grade. This event will usually involve children from neighboring schools competing in several events (it’s usually seven events in my area, so pentathlon loses its meaning). The children are not separated by school – but by temperaments. Each temperament represents a different city-state in Greece, e.g. Red=Sparta, etc. So, from a curriculum point of view, Waldorf schools see some benefit in having, for example, all the “superficial” children compete against each other. All the “lazy” children compete together, as do all the “self-pitying” children and the “destructive dictators.” They get their own colored uniforms or identifications – each associated with Steiner’s colors. Choleric children get red, for example.
The children get to march around all day wearing a uniform that identifies them to their classmates perhaps as “lazy.” Remember this is based at least partly on heredity and body shape. If the identification wasn’t clear from the start, it is easy to see which children are lumped together at a glance. The obese children are all wearing blue. A child simply has to look at their uniform to see who they have been associated with. Often, classmates or siblings will tease children based on the color of their uniform. This can be distressing for some children. And for what? Why separate children by heredity and body shape in the first place?
That teachers/schools would make such a division of children based on some perceived temperament and then have this decision displayed to all the children is, in my opinion, a cruel thing to do to children. To divide children in games using heredity and body shape as a criteria, especially in the way described above, is hurtful nonsense; it is Anthroposophy at its worst. It divides and harms children in a very ugly and thoughtless way. Frankly, if a teacher or school thinks my child is lazy, or superficial, or dictatorial, or self-pitying, they should pretty much keep it out of my child’s consciousness.
I don’t think it is too much of a leap to discuss racism when referring to the above exercise.
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/2009/11/pete-k-declares-war-on-racism-at_06.html
PeteK // Jan 2, 2011 at 04:41
@John Stumbles
“I am saying that in practice Steiner education, as far as I can see from my own experience as a parent and from what my kids and other ex-Steiner pupils say, does not seem to practice racism or turn out racists. ”
Not to invalidate your experience John, but my experience invalidates your experience. It is INDEED their intention to teach Steiner’s racist ideas to children – and that’s exactly what they did to mine.
“It actually seems to turn out quite decent, considerate, socially well-adjusted people, who are probably less inclined to the sorts of inadequacies which seem to be behind racism.”
Again, my experience invalidates yours. Waldorf, in my experience, does NOT turn out well-adjusted people… Many, many children who attend Waldorf come out NOT well-adjusted AT ALL.
“Given that there are only so many hours in the day and cells in my brain I see more important things to do than rail at the rather quaint theoretical idiocy behind Steiner schools which, in practice, seem to be fairly benign.”
Then you should feel free to attend to those things and leave those of us who find the teaching of racist ideology to our children repugnant rather than “benign” to debate how Waldorf teachers treat the subject in Waldorf schools TODAY.
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/2010/12/steiner-quotes-specifically-race.html
- @John Stumbles
“I, too, would find the teaching of racist ideology to my children repugnant, IF it were happening, which it isn’t.”
Again, I invite you to invest your time in the things you feel passionate about. Apparently, refuting the racism that exists in Waldorf, via your personal experience, is one of the things you feel passionate about – at least passionate enough to spend your New Year’s Day pushing your agenda.
“It would be perverse of me to join your campaign against Steiner schools based on your account of what happened at a Waldorf school in the USA whenever it was your kids were there.”
Nobody has asked you to. I just pointed out that racism exists in Waldorf – via the same “proof” that you used to imply it doesn’t. I have additional proof, BTW, and have witnessed dozens of racist and anti-Semitic remarks from Waldorf teachers over the years.
“I do choose to attend to what I regard as more important matters. I’d appreciate it if you and the other anti-Steinerites here would extend to me and other non-Anthro non-antis the courtesy of accepting that we may actually be intelligent, conscientious, free-thinking people who, through our own thinking and experiences, hold opinions that differ from yours.”
Name-calling? Why lower yourself to this? I just said my experience differed from yours… and have documented it. Why am I an anti-Semite sir? Have I even mentioned Jews? Hold any opinions you care to… but I can see you require anything in reality to support them.
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/ - The last line should have read:
“… but I can’t see you require anything in reality to support them.”
of course… ;)
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/2010_03_01_archive.html
- @ TomDehavas
“PeteK // Jan 1, 2011 at 23:21 OK I read your message 27 if that school is doing as you say it should be stamped on but my school did not do that and I think and hope it is an exception. ”
If your school doesn’t have any teachers who use Steiner’s temperaments as indicators to divide, classify and evaluate children, then indeed it IS an exception.
“After all you are talking about the US where racism is a lot deeper than here. It is here but not so deep.”
Racism is “deeper” in the US than the UK? I didn’t know that… When did you Brits stop your racism? Oh… it was always superficial… OK. ;) Do you have history books there?
“lovelyhorse // Jan 1, 2011 at 23:33 You may note that at Wynstones many of the teachers were not Steiner traned and so had not read those texts.”
Perhaps… but what about the ones who were? How do they approach children?
“PeteK // Jan 2, 2011 at 00:09 I heard they did a Greek Olympics at Kings Langly but we never did this at Wynstones and we were never separated by temperaments which I agree is stupid but it isn’t racism so linking the two is stretching it.”
OK… let’s see if it’s racism – and how difficult it must be for teachers to separate what they are taught to look at – what Steiner said about body shape, the temperaments, and races.
Remember, when we were kids, we used to play “which one does not belong?” One out of the following Steiner statements is NOT taken directly from Faculty Meetings with Rudolf Steiner – REQUIRED reading for Waldorf teachers.
“It is certainly a major deficiency that many educational systems pay no attention to such things as, for example, the external appearance of the children.”
“A small head is connected with brooding and reflecting whereas large-headed children are more flighty.”
“Such cases are increasing in which children are born with a human form, but are not really human beings in relation to their highest I; instead, they are filled with beings that do not belong to the human class.”
“I do not like to talk about such things since we have often been attacked even without them. Imagine what people would say if they heard that we say there are people who are not human beings. Nevertheless, these are facts. Our culture would not be in such a decline if people felt more strongly that a number of people are going around who, because they are completely ruthless, have become something that is not human, but instead are demons in human form.
“Nevertheless, we do not want to shout that to the world. Our opposition is already large enough. Such things are really shocking to people. I caused enough shock when I needed to say that a very famous university professor, after a very short time between death and rebirth, was reincarnated as a black scientist. We do not want to shout such things out into the world.”
“In those children with a physically oversized head, you will be able to find what I have just described as deficiencies, namely, lack of attention or a too-strongly developed phlegma.”
“If the blonds and blue-eyed people die out, the human race will become increasingly dense if men do not arrive at a form of intelligence that is independent of blondness. Blond hair actually bestows intelligence…”
“The phenomenon of left-handedness is clearly karmic, and, in connection with karma, it is one of karmic weakness.”
“They are also quite different from human beings in regard to everything spiritual. They can, for example, never remember such things as sentences; they have a memory only for words, not for sentences.”
“The use of the French language quite certainly corrupts the soul. The soul acquires nothing more than the possibility of clichés. Those who enthusiastically speak French transfer that to other languages. The French are also ruining what maintains their dead language, namely, their blood. The French are committing the terrible brutality of moving black people to Europe, but it works, in an even worse way, back on France. It has an enormous effect on the blood and the race and contributes considerably toward French decadence. The French as a race are reverting.”
OK… which one wasn’t directed SPECIFICALLY to Waldorf teachers? And after reading the rest, does it really matter?
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2009-01-01T00%3A00%3A00-08%3A00&updated-max=2010-01-01T00%3A00%3A00-08%3A00&max-results=4 - @Thetis
“Pete – did you mis-read anti-Steinerite as anti-semite? ‘Anti-Steinerite’ is cumbersome as well as daft, I’d add.”
OMG… Yes I did… My apologies to Mr. Stumbles for that.
PK
PeteK // Jan 4, 2011 at 15:09
@Hollywood Tom – Message 171
You said:”I was struck by the phrase “ritualistic recitation,” because it so aptly describes the state of Waldorf criticism — and Waldorf apologetics — which has been raging now on the Internet for 17 years since Dan Dugan inaugurated his Waldorf Critics mailing list in 1994. Over such a long time, the recitation of charges and counter-charges of racism has not changed at all, thus the recycling of the same charges over and over again with the requisite defenses, gains the predictable status of a ritual, a kind of kabuki theater, which is now so finely tuned that contributors on both sides just need to copy and paste their comments from previous blog and mailing list battles — or else leave links behind like Bee droppings.”
Ah, but my friend, I am here to tell you things HAVE changed since 1994. I’m here to point out HIGHLAND HALL TAUGHT STEINER’S RACIST IDEAS TO MY SON. For those who say this doesn’t happen – I’m here to say – IT DOES. Now, you may choose to invalidate me by making comparisons to TheBee – but that doesn’t alter for one instant what ACTUALLY HAPPENED. And this is why I am here Tom – to show what is happening NOW – not in 1994 – but since.
And speaking of which – we’ve seen lots of OFFICIAL apologies from Waldorf since 1994… (including Steiner quotes taken out of context) – which means SOMETHING must be getting through. ;)
Here’s a more modern song for you Tom –
“Time Is Running Out”
I think I’m drowning
Asphyxiated
I wanna break this spell
That you’ve created
You’re something beautiful
A contradiction
I wanna play the game
I want the friction
You will be the death of me
You will be the death of me
Bury it
I won’t let you bury it
I won’t let you smother it
I won’t let you murder it
Our time is running out
Our time is running out
You can’t push it underground
You can’t stop it screaming out
I wanted freedom
Bound and restricted
I tried to give you up
But I’m addicted
Now that you know I’m trapped sense of elation
You’d never dream of
Breaking this fixation
You will squeeze the life out of me
Bury it
I won’t let you bury it
I won’t let you smother it
I won’t let you murder it
Our time is running out
Our time is running out
You can’t push it underground
You can’t stop it screaming out
How did it come to this?
Oh
You will suck the life out of me
Bury it
I won’t let you bury it
I won’t let you smother it
I won’t let you murder it
Our time is running out
Our time is running out
You can’t push it underground
You can’t stop it screaming out
How did it come to this?
Oh
http://petekaraiskos.blogspot.com/2010/10/working-with-highland-hall-open-letter.html
PeteK // Jan 5, 2011 at 03:04
@ Hollywood Tom who said: “What is it you want from these people?”
For me, Tom, that’s a loaded question, because I would like to be compensated for the impact of the horrible education my children received… and for the therapy they have had to have… stuff like that. But getting to the racism in particular – I would like FULL DISCLOSURE – very similar to what you wrote – on every Waldorf document… you know… right there next to where they say they don’t discriminate. That would be perfect! That way there is no “hidden” doctrine that parents have to discover on their own. It would be great if they disclosed a whole bunch of other stuff too, BTW.
Readers should try to get through all the comments... this is a fantastic look at Waldorf education with regard to racism.
